2010, January: the road to Molly Malone's

[Antonio247]

It´s a pity that you got injured although ,in spite of it, you managed to finish quite well, EG. If you hadn´t got injured, you´d have done the 10 km under one hour for sure.

I hope you get better soon so that you can take part at Almería half feeling well.

Best of luck!

Antonio

[marathondan]

Hmm, looks like we need another auto-button added to the forum (to go with "Well done for getting out there"): "Bad luck with the calf injury, EG".

I suppose the relatively good news is that it doesn't seem like a major pull, so will probably mend with a few days' rest. After last year you're an expert at keeping up with exercise while injured, and it's good that you are doing some detective work into the cause. With hindsight, do you think it was wise to complete the course? Seeing as the injury seems not too bad, and you still finished in a confidence-boosting time, the answer is probably yes.

I notice there were only 29 finishers outside 63 mins - a fast field. Probably not a race that attracts many fair-weather fun-runners.

[El Gordo]

Thanks Dan. I finished the course because I was able to, I suppose. My two main injury incidents last winter were too severe to even walk comfortably, never mind jog, so I know for sure that yesterday's wasn't as bad. When it happened the second time last year, I literally had to hop to the pub that was mercifully very close by, to wait for M to come and get me. Yesterday's was painful, and I had hardly any strength in the calf, but it wasn't disabling in the same way.

Why not? Well. the thing I didn't mention, but should have, is that I was wearing my neoprene calf strap, and in fact have worn this on every single run I've done in the last year (apart from Monday's 9-miler, funnily enough, when I forgot to take it with me to Crawley). I wondered how much it 'saved' me yesterday, and have even wondered if not wearing it last Monday helped create the problem yesterday. It really does seem to help when I wear it.

I went for a walk up the road today (OK, I went to the pub to watch Reading-Liverpool), and it's sore, but doesn't feel too 'injured' if you know what I mean. It doesn't feel as if I've pulled or badly strained anything. It just throbs a bit. as though it's recovering from really bad cramp or similar, or even from a very long run. In a way, I'm more anxious about the knee which is more painful.

The more I ponder it, the more I'm sure there's a link between these problems and my footwear. I've been wearing the off-road Asics Trabucos recently for the snow, and on the Worth Way, and while they seem comfortable, they definitely have less cushioning. I'm much more conscious of the road surface beneath my feet than with my usual roadies, which are very cushioned.

It's a nuisance having to rest up for a few days, but I'm beginning to think this is a lucky escape rather than some terrible blow.

Might be worth me going to Sweatshop on a quiet afternoon, and getting some proper gait analysis done, to see what they conclude re choice of footwear.

In the meantime, I reckon I'll still be OK for the gym, so it needn't be an excuse to lose too much fitness.

[El Gordo]

It´s a pity that you got injured although ,in spite of it, you managed to finish quite well, EG. If you hadn´t got injured, you´d have done the 10 km under one hour for sure.

I hope you get better soon so that you can take part at Almería half feeling well.

Best of luck!

Antonio

Thanks Anlu. I've no idea if I'd have got under the hour, and it's sort of academic to wonder. Knowing me from past races, I tend to flop a bit towards the end, so I can't presume anything. Chances are I would have just missed out, but we'll never know, and there's no point in speculating. What was interesting was using the Garmin 'virtual partner' thing. It helped me keep a very steady pace for the first mile or two, and definitely a bit slower than I would have normally done. This was a very useful experiment, even if I was distracted by the leg problem a bit further on. It tells me it might benefit me to aim for steady average pace, instead of the classic mistake of going out too fast. Strange how I always advise new runners to do this, but tend not to do it myself.

Unless there's some unexpected complication, I fully intend doing the Almeria Half. Worst case scenario is to not feel able to go for a PB which was/is the plan. I'll see how I go between now and then.

[Mid Life Crisis Marathon Man]

Yes, commiserations and congratulations both in order - certainly a good time considering the strife you were in. It wasn't, um, your eleventh such injury I suppose

But yes, well done for getting through it and best of luck with the recuperation.

[El Gordo]

Yes, commiserations and congratulations both in order - certainly a good time considering the strife you were in. It wasn't, um, your eleventh such injury I suppose

But yes, well done for getting through it and best of luck with the recuperation.

Cheers mate.

Leg is feeling better today. Yesterday I could walk up the stairs normally, but could come down only one step at a time (obviously uses different muscles). This morning, I was able to walk down the stairs nornally, even though the leg is still sore when I put weight on it. I definitely think I might have got away with this one. The more I think about it, the more I reckon the calf strap helped -- both having it on during the race, and having it there as a support since then.

Plan is to do nothing today, but perhaps try some non-impact stuff at the gym over the next couple of days. I've booked a sports massage for later in the week, and would hope to be able to try a run within a few days. I don't want to be stuck in Cornwall for too long...

[glaconman]

Good luck with getting over this strain quickly EG.

Regarding race strategy I would always advise being agressive in the first half of a race. I think it's been proved by sports scientists that if you go out faster than you're comfortable with your body will cope better than you expect in the closing stages and bring you home in a faster time.

Well, it's a fine line I know; and getting the balance right is not easy and can result in some uncomfortable and long-drawn-out finishes. But if you're after pbs and feel right on the day I reckon that's the way you have to play it.

[Sweder]

Commiserations on the bad calf. The temptation is to push through to Almeria, yet we both know how that can go. I've had my own shot across the bows this week and I'm thinking hard about redefining my goals for the end of the month. Well done for getting through the race. There's little worse for a runner than having to pull during a race due to injury.

[marathondan]

Regarding race strategy I would always advise being agressive in the first half of a race. I think it's been proved by sports scientists that if you go out faster than you're comfortable with your body will cope better than you expect in the closing stages and bring you home in a faster time

Wow, that's the first time I've seen anyone say that. Do you have a link, GM? I tend to agree, up to 10K - I feel there's little to lose, and I want to finish having spent every drop of energy. But for longer distances, personally I prefer to have an evenly paced plan, and stick to it.

Then again, this strategy doesn't seem to have done you any harm in your recent races...

[Sweder]

Agree with Dan on this; my Almeria effort last January was a case in point. I attacked the first quarter of the race full-on only to find my pace degraded in the latter stages no matter how hard I felt I was pushing. Ladyrunner adopted a more cautious start and passed my before halfway to finish going away.

It does sound like an excellent strategy for shorter races (5k, 10k), which is where it was directed (I think).
As Dan says, it's served G-man well recently.

On a point of order should the title of this thread be 'January: the road to the bar formerly known as Molly Malones'?

[El Gordo]

Agree with Dan on this; my Almeria effort last January was a case in point. I attacked the first quarter of the race full-on only to find my pace degraded in the latter stages no matter how hard I felt I was pushing. Ladyrunner adopted a more cautious start and passed my before halfway to finish going away.

It does sound like an excellent strategy for shorter races (5k, 10k), which is where it was directed (I think).
As Dan says, it's served G-man well recently.

On a point of order should the title of this thread be 'January: the road to the bar formerly known as Molly Malones'?

It does seem to go against the usual advice of starting slowly. My usual strategy is start very slowly and then reduce the speed. Though I can't really dignify it with the word "strategy" which suggests it's predetermined.

Yes, I can see that it would make more sense with the shorter distances, but for me, even 10K is too long to try to sustain a relatively quick start. I hope that might change a bit as the weight continues to fall, and stamina improves.

Point taken re Molly's, though I don't think I can change a thread title. THe big question is whether they are still dispensing draught Guinness. A Plan B might be necessary.

[Sweder]

Point taken re Molly's, though I don't think I can change a thread title. THe big question is whether they are still dispensing draught Guinness. A Plan B might be necessary.

I've thought of little else since my decision to spurn the Dark side.
Arriving in Almeria to find it devoid of Guinness might be too much to bear ...

[Antonio247]

Point taken re Molly's, though I don't think I can change a thread title. THe big question is whether they are still dispensing draught Guinness. A Plan B might be necessary.

I've thought of little else since my decision to spurn the Dark side.
Arriving in Almeria to find it devoid of Guinness might be too much to bear ...

You needen´t worry about the black matter, S. I think there is still Guinness there. Anyway, I´ll have to tell them to get a lot of kegs for that long weekend. However, I find Burana, new Molly Malone´s,too noisy.

[glaconman]

You're right of course Dan. The caveat is that this strategy is more relevant to the shorter distances:

runners world article

The 2 ten milers I've done this year proved to me that even pacing during longer distances is probably a more successful approach.

I suppose all I'm really saying is that negative splits don't appeal to me mentally. I like to force myself into abit of a corner and see what I'm made of.

But then other people advocate it:

negative splits article

Maybe I should try it

[Sweder]

You needen´t worry about the black matter, S. I think there is still Guinness there. Anyway, I´ll have to tell them to get a lot of kegs for that long weekend. However, I find Burana, new Molly Malone´s,too noisy.

The bar itself is of little consequence. I think others have expressed a similar opinion re: noisy patrons (though I feel this is a case of pots snd kettles). Funny how after a few hours that problem seems to go away ...

The main issue is this. There are several bars in Almeria that serve Guinness. Most of them use that odd can/ tablet arrangement which, to be honest, is worse than drinking fizzy lager. If there's another bar in the locale that serves Black Gold from a keg I'd be more than happy to give it a go. Otherwise might I respectfully recommend headphones/ ear muffs?

I'm quite prepared to switch to Rioja if that makes life easier. Hic.

[El Gordo]

You needen´t worry about the black matter, S. I think there is still Guinness there. Anyway, I´ll have to tell them to get a lot of kegs for that long weekend. However, I find Burana, new Molly Malone´s,too noisy.

The bar itself is of little consequence. I think others have expressed a similar opinion re: noisy patrons (though I feel this is a case of pots snd kettles). Funny how after a few hours that problem seems to go away ...

The main issue is this. There are several bars in Almeria that serve Guinness. Most of them use that odd can/ tablet arrangement which, to be honest, is worse than drinking fizzy lager. If there's another bar in the locale that serves Black Gold from a keg I'd be more than happy to give it a go. Otherwise might I respectfully recommend headphones/ ear muffs?

I'm quite prepared to switch to Rioja if that makes life easier. Hic.

Agree with all of that.

Not sure what sort of "noisy" the bar has become, but if that means it's become disco-ey, then I suggest we find somewhere else.

I've done a Google trawl without immediately finding an alternative. No other Irish bars anyway. Antonio -- I appreciate you're not an expert on bars in the town, but are you aware of any other possibilities?

The one place I wondered about was that bar we went to in 2006, the second year we were there, when it was just Sweder and SP and me. We went to a bar which I think was not too far from the hotel. Quite a biggish place, very busy... they were showing football... fairly young clientele.... no idea if they had draught Guinness - probably not... we met a runner you knew who had just run the half in 1:08. (He had two bottles of beer then went home to bed -- let that be a lesson to us all...). Do you recall the place I'm thinking of? It may be that I've exaggerated the memory but it seemed quite a decent place.

Molly's has become a tradition but I have no particular affiliation to the place. In fact, I feel pretty neutral towards it. A bit the same with Guinness actually

So I'm happy to branch out. There must be some alternatives.

[Sweder]

we met a runner you knew who had just run the half in 1:08. (He had two bottles of beer then went home to bed -- let that be a lesson to us all...).

That was 'John Peter Tables'
That bar was certainly pretty good from a football point of view. Clientelle was a little older (ie above school age) and a little less hysterical. I don't recall being driven out by thumping music either.

Disco at Molly's might appeal to -ahem - certain members of our party.

[El Gordo]

we met a runner you knew who had just run the half in 1:08. (He had two bottles of beer then went home to bed -- let that be a lesson to us all...).

That was 'John Peter Tables'
That bar was certainly pretty good from a football point of view. Clientelle was a little older (ie above school age) and a little less hysterical. I don't recall being driven out by thumping music either.

Disco at Molly's might appeal to -ahem - certain members of our party.

Y-y-you m-mean there are y-y-young people in the party? Gah! I knew it would all go pear-shaped if I missed a year!

[Antonio247]

we met a runner you knew who had just run the half in 1:08. (He had two bottles of beer then went home to bed -- let that be a lesson to us all...).

That was 'John Peter Tables'
That bar was certainly pretty good from a football point of view. Clientelle was a little older (ie above school age) and a little less hysterical. I don't recall being driven out by thumping music either.

Disco at Molly's might appeal to -ahem - certain members of our party.

Y-y-you m-mean there are y-y-young people in the party? Gah! I knew it would all go pear-shaped if I missed a year!

Yes, it is a big bar near the hotel. I´ll ask Juan Pedro if they serve Guinness in a keg. The only problem is that it is a bit far away from the city centre if you want to go to "El quinto toro". It could be a good alternative for Sunday afternoon drinks while watching football.

Anyway, you can have a look at the new Molly Malone´s or I can look for another pub in the city centre that serves Guinness. I´ll find out since I don´t know much about bars in my hometown. Well, actually, I´m a nearly complete teetotaler although when you all come here, I drink nealy all the alcohol I have in one year.

[marathondan]

You're right of course Dan. The caveat is that this strategy is more relevant to the shorter distances:

runners world article

The 2 ten milers I've done this year proved to me that even pacing during longer distances is probably a more successful approach.

I suppose all I'm really saying is that negative splits don't appeal to me mentally. I like to force myself into abit of a corner and see what I'm made of.

But then other people advocate it:

negative splits article

Maybe I should try it

Thanks for the links, both interesting articles. In 10Ks I've gone out hard, and it's been quite successful. My rationale being that I can put up with considerable discomfort for 45-50 mins. For my last marathon I used a gently declining pace, based on Hal Higdon's book, but tightly monitored and controlled, and it worked a treat. Maybe a half marathon would be an interesting arena to try planned negative splits.