What I talk about when I talk about swimming

[Bierzo Baggie]

Don't expect much excitement here...

10 times up and down the pool; 1000m in 32 minutes. Would have been closer to 30 but the elastic went in my trunks and I had to swim with one arm.

Managed to convince myself that walking is just another form of running. Suggesting the same for swimming might be a tad harder....

[Bierzo Baggie]

2x500m
16.20+16.13=32:33
Not sure if swimming in a pair of baggy shorts was a good idea.
Looking for some streamlined speedos.
Oh yes, I am a fish....

[Mid Life Crisis Marathon Man]

Swimming is a slow form of drowning I think ... certainly in my case anyway.

[marathondan]

Put in a km on the graveyard shift last night - 10-11pm. I had hastily cobbled together some bullet point tips from the internet, printed them and put them in a plastic wallet to leave poolside:

• Water level between eyebrows and hairline (that's theoretical hairline for me - my actual hairline is somewhere at the back of my head)
  
• Look forward and downward
  
• Shoulder out of water as arm exits
  
• Hips rotate slightly, under surface
  
• Body roll – on a skewer, 45 degrees
  
• 3 kicks per arm
  
• Kick from hips
  
• Arm entry between centreline of head and shoulderline
  
• Thumb enters first
  
• Elbow exits first
  
• Hand sweep underwater back in towards centreline
  
• Breathe with body roll, don’t lift the head – Popeye
  
• Continuous exhalation
  
• Bilateral breathing
  
• Count strokes – efficiency
  

I didn't have time (or memory) to put all of these into practice, but "thumb entry first" seemed to make a difference. I also realised that as I was always running out of breath, maybe I should try breathing more often. So I cut down from breathing on three strokes to two, but with an extra stroke every ten or so to keep me changing side.

I also tried counting strokes towards the end, and found I was pretty consistently putting in 26 for the 25 m - with a bit of a glide as well. A guy in the next (better) lane looked pretty smooth, and he was putting in around 20 off a bigger glide, which was encouraging. It strikes me that this is a very good measurement of efficiency, and this article (googled just now) agrees. And it looks like I've got a long way to go: "at 6-foot-plus, taking 21 strokes under any circumstances is no different than wildly spinning your pedals in a low gear while cycling down a hill".

[glaconman]

Great list Dan. I remember doing the same thing when I was trying to improve at squash. I had about 10 key points to remember. But in the heat-of-battle I found it impossible to consciously put more than one into practice at any given time. So it was a question of ticking one off at a time and only moving onto the next when I had adopted it to some degree.

[Bierzo Baggie]

Lots of useful stuff there. My most immediate problem is with my ears. After a few visits to the pool I become as deaf as a post but it gets better if I don’t swim for a few days. Maybe I should get my ears syringed.
I did say this thread would be exciting (my next post will be on ingrowing toenails...)

Anyway, loads of great tips from Dan to experiment with.

As for swimmimg being boring I think MLCM has missed the point.
Boring is an unfairly treated adjective I’d say. Nothing wrong with boring.

Swimming’s a bit like yoga I suppose. Great way of emptying your mind.

I just wish I could empty my ears..

[Mid Life Crisis Marathon Man]

As for swimmimg being boring I think MLCM has missed the point.
Boring is an unfairly treated adjective I’d say. Nothing wrong with boring.

Swimming’s a bit like yoga I suppose. Great way of emptying your mind.

Fair point. I was never much good at yoga, either.

[Bierzo Baggie]

In relation to Dan's list..

• Water level between eyebrows and hairline (that's theoretical hairline for me - my actual hairline is somewhere at the back of my head)
  I swim with my face flat in the water.
  
• Look forward and downward
  I tend to look at the floor and not ahead as I should do.
  
• Shoulder out of water as arm exits
  Difficult not to?
  
• Hips rotate slightly, under surface
  Very slightly.
  
• Body roll – on a skewer, 45 degrees
  Not sure if I do that.
  
• 3 kicks per arm
  Maybe..
  
• Kick from hips
  No, more of a wriggle of toes.
  
• Arm entry between centreline of head and shoulderline
  Not sure about this one.
  
• Thumb enters first
  Definitely plunge in fingertips first.
  
• Elbow exits first
  Not sure, probably yes.
  
• Hand sweep underwater back in towards centreline
  Yes.
  
• Breathe with body roll, don’t lift the head – Popeye
  Yes.
  
• Continuous exhalation
  Yes.
  
• Bilateral breathing
  No
  
• Count strokes – efficiency
  Wildly spinning pedals.
  

Wow, there's more to trhis than meets the eye..

[marathondan]

Body roll – on a skewer, 45 degrees
Not sure if I do that.

Not sure about that one - 45 degrees, really? But it seems the body should be straight in a line, and rotating as on a skewer.

3 kicks per arm
Maybe..

This is variable; someone said 6, 8 or 10 per full cycle is acceptable (so I chose the lowest). But elsewhere I saw mention of a 2-beat kick (i.e. just one per arm).

Kick from hips
No, more of a wriggle of toes.

Many people, including Tom, have noted that runners tend to have overly rigid ankles when swimming.

Thumb enters first
Definitely plunge in fingertips first.

I think the sideways entry reduces drag. It's an easy one to fix, and certainly felt smoother for me.

Bilateral breathing
No

This is recommended for open water swimming, in case you get prevailing waves (or a splashy swimmer) on one side. But obviously also good for balancing up the muscle use.

Wow, there's more to trhis than meets the eye..

And this is just the basics...

[Sweder]

Just as I thought: best left to the fish

[Mid Life Crisis Marathon Man]

Just as I thought: best left to the fish

Amen, brother Ash.

[marathondan]

Just as I thought: best left to the fish

Two things have recently occurred to me:

1. I need something to train for during the summer months. I've now done one marathon a year for the last three years and my joints have never felt better. But I think two a year might be less good for me. It's still a possibility, but a low impact activity sounds like a better idea.

2. I haven't done any upper body exercise in the last 20 years, as witnessed by my limp flailings in the pool. And actually I didn't really do any for the 20 years before that either - I was just young enough for it not to be a problem. It would be good rectify that situation.

[Bierzo Baggie]

Just as I thought: best left to the fish

Two things have recently occurred to me:

1. I need something to train for during the summer months. I've now done one marathon a year for the last three years and my joints have never felt better. But I think two a year might be less good for me. It's still a possibility, but a low impact activity sounds like a better idea.

2. I haven't done any upper body exercise in the last 20 years, as witnessed by my limp flailings in the pool. And actually I didn't really do any for the 20 years before that either - I was just young enough for it not to be a problem. It would be good rectify that situation.

Amen, brother Dan.

[Sweder]

Just as I thought: best left to the fish

Two things have recently occurred to me:

1. I need something to train for during the summer months. I've now done one marathon a year for the last three years and my joints have never felt better. But I think two a year might be less good for me. It's still a possibility, but a low impact activity sounds like a better idea.

2. I haven't done any upper body exercise in the last 20 years, as witnessed by my limp flailings in the pool. And actually I didn't really do any for the 20 years before that either - I was just young enough for it not to be a problem. It would be good rectify that situation.

That's all well and good but fish do it so well, and they ain't got arms.

It's a good point about upper body strength. For 26.2 and beyond lack of core/ upper body strength causes most of the problems. I too do bugger all above the waist (Oi Oi!!) aside from swinging sticks and shuffling badly seared meat on the Barbie.

I just can't embrace swimming. Perhaps its because I'm so hopeless technique-wise? In that case I need lesson. 49 and going for swimming lessons? Hmm. Why not? Could do worse.

Maybe a triathlon's not completely out of the question after all.

[marathondan]

Who knows whether I'll actually get around to competing, but it's interesting to be starting out on a new learning curve. I think I'll persevere for a few more weeks and then sign up for some lessons. I understand that Mr T. Roper has been having some recently.

Picked up a decent bike pump today, so at last I can inflate the tyres of my rusty steed to some degree of firmness. Running isn't this complicated.

[marathondan]

Another arduous kilometer logged this week. Once a week isn't really enough to improve, but it's hard for me to get to the pool more often than that. Running is so much simpler...

Still consistent at 27 strokes per length. But my multi-tasking skills are being stretched. I can't count strokes, remember when to breathe, and count kicks, at the same time. Something always falls by the wayside (often breathing, unfortunately). I think taking up jazz percussion might be simpler. After a while I stopped counting the strokes per length and started looking at what my hands do under the water. Not sure if it's right or not, but that's the next area of focus.

40 lengths seemed to take even longer this time. More stopping and thinking time perhaps. Still, it's not about speed, but efficiency, at this stage.

Also discovered that my breast stroke is just as terrible as my crawl. Luke (8) challenged me to a race in a 9m pool this week, him backstroke and me breast. I just about scraped a dead heat.

[Bierzo Baggie]

Swimming left me deaf for a week or so.

When I tried again I did a couple of lengths with a mobile phone in my pocket.

So, after the initial enthusiasm I almost decided to leave swimming to the fish.

Tried again this morning.

2x500m
15:30 + 14:58 = 30:28
All front crawl which is a first.

Experimented with a few of Dan’s tips, but once you’ve picked up bad habits it’s very difficult to “undo” them. Probably better to get the technique right from the start... good advice for almost anything I suppose.

Rolling: Can’t do it and breath properly at the same time.
Looking ahead instead of downwards: Tend to forget.

Squeezed head into a tight silicon swim cap which I pulled down over my ears. Seemed to do the trick. Squeezed arse into go-faster swim trunks. Went only very slightly faster.

In any case, at this time of year I get back from a run and feel exhausted, really drained. Half an hour in the pool is sort of revitalising.. and it gives you an appetite too!

[marathondan]

Good time BB, you're improving!

This week I inadvertently did 75m crawl without a "breast break" (not as enjoyable as it sounds); I'm nowhere near keeping it going for 500m.

I wouldn't like to take credit for any of the tips, nor indeed would I vouch for any of them being correct. There seems to be contradictory advice out there.

I'm wondering whether it's better to look straight down after all. I did try the body roll and it somehow felt unnatural yet helpful. I also tried reaching down low towards the bottom of the pool on the pull. I don't know whether that's right or not, but it increased my roll.

So, as I was saying, I can't vouch for these tips. In fact I just did another google and came up with this, which looks like a good site, but states "We suggest you avoid thumb-first entry like the plague". OK, scratch that one then. They're big on body roll though.

[marathondan]

Something to work up to.

[Bierzo Baggie]

Something to work up to.

Interesting....
constant ear problems made me very wary of swimming in recent weeks which is a shame. I'll keep the thread open but I'm avoiding the water for now...

Confession time. I'm in some way related to Cptn Matthew Webb, the first man to swim the english channel. He was a Shropshire man and my mum's grandma was originally a Webb. I think she was his niece.
Cpt Webb died trying to swim across rapids at the base of the Niagra falls.

Sweder's right you know, ....it's best left to the fish.