The football thread - relegation and running

[Unregistered]

Time to respond to Andy's football notes. 'I'm not interested in football, I just support West Ham'. That's the saying of my lifetime.

Fortunately, I was away for the Bolton game at the Reebok, where the season's final die was most likely cast. At least it saved me the torture by teletext. It was good to beat 'Boro, but it wasn't the classic six pointer of the week before.

Leeds' win at Fulham makes it look even more dire. Glenn Roeder has been struck down by the stress of it all and even with Saint Trevor Brooking confirmed as caretaker manager, it's looking like other results will have to go our way, whatever happens against Man City on Sunday.

A marathon looks almost easy in comparison. Let's see - the race starts at 1 pm, and kickoff is at 2 pm. I run past my sister's house at 13 miles, hopefully at around 3 pm. Should I ask the half-time score ? Game over (perhaps literally) by 4 pm, just as I hit the wall running up Rumer Hill for the second time at around 18 miles.

What if somehow I hear the final score as I toil the last long miles into Stratford ? Or what if I don't ? It'll certainly add a different edge to the usual late April relegation stress.

[El Gordo]

That message was from Nigel, in case you hadn't worked it out.

(At least it demonstrates that you don't have to be registered to post a message.)

Yes, it looks like Sunday afternoon could become one of those "you'll never guess what I was doing when I heard that West Ham had won 8-2 at Man City, that season when we just avoided relegation at the last minute..." occasions.

I hope West Ham stay up but it's looking difficult, mainly because Bolton haven't hit the disastrous patch of form that was a necessary part of the survival scenario. Leeds and Fulham have hit bad times, but just too late.

There's only one faint consolation if West Ham do go down, and that's that there's a chance that they might be playing QPR next season. We're looking pretty good for a play-off place, though our recent record in cup competitions (which essentially is what the play-offs are) do not give me any confidence that we'll get to the final, never mind win the thing.

I was sorry to hear about Glen Roeder's illness. He's still remembered fondly at Loftus Road as the lynchpin of our successful early 80s side - the one that got to the FA Cup Final and won promotion under Venables.

As for your results strategy on Sunday. it may be out of your hands. When I did the Silverstone race, I heard a number of conversations about the Arsenal match that kicked off just after the race started. People obviously had radios or were being kept up to date by phone.

I think perhaps I'd try to avoid the score till after the end of the race. At least that way you can pass the time clutching at mental straws, and enjoying the final shreds of hope. I can't help feeling that if you heard they were losing it would not help your run.

Good luck on all fronts.

I'm expecting another race report of which Shakespeare himself would have been proud.

[Nigel]

Thanks for that Andy - "I think perhaps I'd try to avoid the score.... At least that way you can pass the time clutching at mental straws, and enjoying the final shreds of hope."

It's more than the story of one match or even one season - truly you have penned the perfect characterisation of an entire life as a West Ham supporter.

And I'm going to hang onto that mental image "you'll never guess what I was doing that day when we beat City 8-2....". In years to come, I might even convince myself it actually happened.

QPR in the play-offs, eh ? As one old enough to remember Stan Bowles and Rodney Marsh, it'd be good to see a renaissance at Loftus Road. I've always felt Chelsea shouldn't have a monopoly on the London fans in chenille jackets and designer stubble.

Well then, almost time to lace up those Doc Martens for Sunday's run.

[Nigel]

"you can pass the time clutching at mental straws, and enjoying the final shreds of hope"

I'm forever blowing bubbles
Pretty bubbles in the air
They fly so high
Nearly reach the sky
Then like my dreams
They fade and die

Fortune’s always hiding
I've looked everywhere
I'm forever blowing bubbles
Pretty bubbles in the air

[El Gordo]

One of the great football anthems, and touchingly self-deprecating. Perhaps one of the reasons I've always liked West Ham.

I remember being at the FA Cup Final in 1975 when West Ham beat Fulham 2-0. Two goals from the prolific Alan Taylor, if memory serves. I recall being overwhelmed by the mass-singing of that anthem at the end, as they did their lap of honour.

As for QPR, I wouldn't call it a renaissance. When you continue to descend through the fatter end of the football league pyramid, the law of averages says that eventually you'll reach a point where you can actually be made to look relatively proficient by the sheer direness of your brethren. Division 2 is that level for us. Renaissance? More like the first few bubbles on a pot of thick soup, slowly heating up on a very low flame. So low a flame that the merest puff of passing wind will extinguish it.

Seriously, one good thing about being relegated, IF you are relegated, is the rediscovery of what it is like to win matches against inferior opposition. People tend to think it's better being at the foot of the Premiership than the top of the First, but I disagree. There's nothing like following a winning team, whatever division you're in.

The danger - the BIG danger - is that you'll lose so many of your decent players (and West Ham have many) that you'll end up doing a Bradford or a Sheff Wed or a QPR indeed, and spiral down further.

I hope not.

But have a great run on Sunday anyway, and enjoy it while you can...

[Nigel]

I was there ! FA Cup Final against Fulham in 1975, with a Bobby Moore now past his best but still turning out a memorable performance, for once not in a West Ham shirt. I was 14.

Back again in 1980 to see Saint Trevor score a rare header to lift an unlikely FA Cup win against Arsenal. This time it wasn't 'Bubbles' but the poetic Cockney echoes of 'There's only one team in L-arn-den' which I remember so well.

But the following year was my most memorable Wembley visit, this time for a League Cup Final against Arsenal. The Hammers were outplayed for much of the game, but were awarded a penalty in the dying seconds which Ray Stewart calmly put away to earn a replay. Although ultimately to no avail, Stewart's coolness under the most intense pressure provided one of the finest sporting moments I can remember. It was 22 years ago and I can still feel my neck muscles craning to catch a view of the penalty spot at the other end.

Happy days.

[soreblisters]

Being a Southampton fan I know exactly what the pain of final day escapes from relegation are like.

West Ham fans have my deepest sympathy. A nice bunch of fans who I've never had any trouble or complaint with.

As for running a marathon while you've got an important game on...well at this years FLM I had the added incentive of getting round so I could get back to my hotel to watch the Saints play in the FA Cup semi-finals.

[El Gordo]

So it must have been a pretty memorable day all in all then, SB?

Last year, I got back from FLM in time to watch Chelsea v Fulham in the semis. That was a weird game as I wanted them both to lose.

A few weeks ago I'd have regarded this year's contest as a foregone conclusion in Arsenal's favour but they seem a bit out of sorts at the moment, so you never know. Most neutrals would still back Arsenal to win but it's much less certain now.

Being the unfortunate age that I am, I well remember Southampton beating Man Utd in 1976. Was it Bobby Stokes? Or am I mixing up the name with someone else? He was so overcome with emotion after scoring that he fainted and had to be revived on the touchline.

Nigel will be pleased with the result from Maine Road (West Ham won 1-0). THey're still in with a chance, though it will be tough trying to beat Chelsea in midweek, especially as Chelsea need to win to have any chance of Champions League football.

---

How did you do in the marathon by the way?

[soreblisters]

Your memory serves you well Andy. It was Bobby Stokes who scored in the FA Cup final. Good news this year is we lost the toss for the preferred hotel and kit, so we get to wear the same yellow and blue kit as in '76 and we get to take the 'lucky' dressing room in Cardiff. Fingers crossed.

As for the marathon it was alright, a bit too hot though. The fact that I only ran about half a dozen 6 milers and a few 3 milers and the Silverstone Half meant that my training wasn't really up to scratch. Enjoyed the day none the less and came in 6hr 11mins. Not bothered about the time that much just happy to get round and experience everything. Won't be doing another marathon though. Have a look at my web page for the full write up.

Good luck for Dublin

[El Gordo]

Originally posted by soreblisters

The fact that I only ran about half a dozen 6 milers and a few 3 milers and the Silverstone Half meant that my training wasn't really up to scratch.

Gulp! That's a pretty impressive understatement David. I'll have to get along to your website and catch up with what happened - I must admit I haven't visited for a while.

For anyone else, it's at http://www.soreblisters.co.uk

[soreblisters]

It was a case of too many injuries at the start of training and the possibility that I might not be able to make it next year forced me into at least having a go.

I was prepared to drop out if I had to but I managed to keep going. I was only looking to get round in about 5:30 anyway so it wasn't that bad really.